Future for Stena on Irish Sea

[hhvferry]

Would Stena have competition issues if they tried to start up a Liverpool-Dublin route of their own? I don't know, it would seem to be outside the remit the authorities if it is not a takeover; but certainly they didn't go anywhere near DFDS's route when they took on the Belfast one, presumably sure in the knowledge that would be rejected.

Stena's ability and willingness to invest massively in seemingly marginal routes has raised eyebrows before but I would still be surprised if they put a ship with a high capital cost and relatively high operating economics like the Superfast X on the Fishguard-Rosslare route. New shoreside infrastructure could be justified as spread over very long term but for a new ship they would likely be looking for something cheaper or nearer the end of its Stena career for the route - maybe the Jutlandica, maybe even the Nautica; but that would only ever be driven by those ships' existing routes needing and having replacements.

[TC]

Good point. I recall P&O were of the opinion European Ambassador / Stena Nordica was a little on the thirsty side, and a reason why they decided to drop the Dublin - Cherbourg run, despite it being highly popular - left a lot of people in P&O quite surprised. Irish Ferries certainly seem to be operating the route quite successfully with a Visentini, which would be more economical for sure.

The last sailing I went on with Norfolk Line, was in about 2009. I remember the decks had a good enough load, especially the main deck. A lot of Woodside Haulage trailers, even the odd Ferrymasters! However I do think by 2010 the route was struggling. But I do remember one heck of a boom at P&O Dublin / Liverpool Operations, which is still continuing. If you ever go on P&O Dublin - Liverpool, when your sitting waiting to get on the vessel, the amount of freight that is being moved is quite impressive. P&O's response was to move Endeavour onto the route, but she too is sailing fully loaded. I think there is real demand for a 4th vessel on Dublin to Liverpool. P&O could charter a vessel like M.V. Levante, built in 1994 by Fiancantieri, to a design by Van der Giessen de Noord. She looks remarkably like Norbank / Norbay, but certainly lacks in passenger capacity, however boasts 1800 lane metres.

http://www.ferry-site.dk/ferry.php?id=9031698&lang=en

[Steven]

Would Stena have competition issues if they tried to start up a Liverpool-Dublin route of their own? I don't know, it would seem to be outside the remit the authorities if it is not a takeover; but certainly they didn't go anywhere near DFDS's route when they took on the Belfast one, presumably sure in the knowledge that would be rejected.

I don't think the Liverpool -Dublin route was doing that well, plus there was the knowledge that the planned takeover of P&O's central corridor operation had been blocked by the authorities on competition grounds not that long before hand.  However, they turned the Belfast - Liverpool route around so I don't see any reason they can't do the same with the Dublin link.  It would also provide an alternative of course to Holyhead.  Regarding Malo Seaways/Nordica, I believe she can be thirsty at full power (compared to say a Visentini), however at a reduced speed this would be less of an issue.  Who knows with the competition authorities though - Dublin - Liverpool and Holyhead seem to have been considered the same market, yet Dover - Dunkerque and Calais were not, after all!  However, I too don't really see how organic expansion could cause an issue.  Perhaps Stena Gothica, a ship which has long since been paid for and is near the end of her useful life, would be another option.  Either as an additional ship to Holyhead or to test the market for a link to 12 quays?

[HSS]

I remember it we'll in the eighties  over and back to London  euston. It was fantastic hop off the boat  and the train was there right beside you. A full st Columba on a Friday night with all the banter from all the lads off to see a match  , with trains off to , London ,Birmingham , Manchester ,Liverpool, etc .the place was a hive of activity. Good times for sure , and the days when foot passangers were treated very well.

That's it, the good old days! The train WAS there right beside you.

[PaddyL]

Good point. I recall P&O were of the opinion European Ambassador / Stena Nordica was a little on the thirsty side, and a reason why they decided to drop the Dublin - Cherbourg run, despite it being highly popular - left a lot of people in P&O quite surprised. Irish Ferries certainly seem to be operating the route quite successfully with a Visentini, which would be more economical for sure.

I recall being told by a P&O employee that Dublin - Cherbourg was very profitable and some regretted that P&O didn't move the Ambassador full-time to that route instead of selling her to Stena.

[TC]

I could never figure out why P&O would spend a small fortune building a brand new vessel, and then only four years later sell her to Stena. It shows you the sheer difference in thinking and approach with the move from P&O European Ferries, to P&O Ferries. Around 2004 the P&O restructuring programme came in and pretty much erased what could become fairly decent routes. I always found the problem with P&O Portsmouth  was the ships never had enough freight capacity. Oodles of passenger capacity - ridiculous levels to be honest, and very limited freight capacity. In my opinion the only vessel with any decent freight levels was Pride of Cherbourg (better known as Isle of Inishfree, 1995), however as she was a charter vessel, she was for the axe as well.

[fiachrab]

well all know is Holyhead is changing hss is going and there's a new the superfast x soi wonder whats going to happen to hss i hope it will return

[Steven]

I could never figure out why P&O would spend a small fortune building a brand new vessel, and then only four years later sell her to Stena. It shows you the sheer difference in thinking and approach with the move from P&O European Ferries, to P&O Ferries. Around 2004 the P&O restructuring programme came in and pretty much erased what could become fairly decent routes. I always found the problem with P&O Portsmouth  was the ships never had enough freight capacity. Oodles of passenger capacity - ridiculous levels to be honest, and very limited freight capacity. In my opinion the only vessel with any decent freight levels was Pride of Cherbourg (better known as Isle of Inishfree, 1995), however as she was a charter vessel, she was for the axe as well.

On what Brittany Ferries see very much as "their turf", anyone would struggle.  Just ask DFDS/LD Lines!  You forget that the former Olau twins had capacity for some 120 trailers each, just 22 less than Pride of Cherbourg/Innisfree.  Shame about their high operating costs, but they were never designed to be run on a shoestring really. 

Back to Stena, and it seems the additional ship rumour refuses to go away.  Whether thats any indication that it will happen, is of course, anyones guess. 

[fiachrab]

Ideas that stena line should do to its routes.
First off all i can understand why  stena got rid of HSS due to fuel issues i think instead of getting read of it is to get a smaller fast craft like the swift that is more profitable and move it to dublin [prt and shut down dun loaghire.The HSS dropping is unstandble but i think its not right as irish ferries currently has 3 vessles and a fast ferry.stena line should bring back the fast ferries 2018 or 19 even for scotland routes and other. and introudce a vessel for holyhead to dubin and dover like elipsion irish ferries elipsion

[NathanBrady]

Ideas that stena line should do to its routes.
First off all i can understand why  stena got rid of HSS due to fuel issues i think instead of getting read of it is to get a smaller fast craft like the swift that is more profitable and move it to dublin [prt and shut down dun loaghire.The HSS dropping is unstandble but i think its not right as irish ferries currently has 3 vessles and a fast ferry.stena line should bring back the fast ferries 2018 or 19 even for scotland routes and other. and introudce a vessel for holyhead to dubin and dover like elipsion irish ferries elipsion

Did Irish ferries get another boat?  Dey are even getting rid of the fast cat when the big new boat arrives any way.  Holyhead to Dover ?

[IFPete]

Westpack Express " Dublin Swift" is two years younger but will a lot less mileage on her engines and will accomodate 250 cars or 16 lorrys compared to 200 cars on Jonathan Swift. Swift was showing signs of her age during maintenance so it was a good move to replace her now.

[Steven]

Ideas that stena line should do to its routes.
First off all i can understand why  stena got rid of HSS due to fuel issues i think instead of getting read of it is to get a smaller fast craft like the swift that is more profitable and move it to dublin [prt and shut down dun loaghire.The HSS dropping is unstandble but i think its not right as irish ferries currently has 3 vessles and a fast ferry.stena line should bring back the fast ferries 2018 or 19 even for scotland routes and other. and introudce a vessel for holyhead to dubin and dover like elipsion irish ferries elipsion

Did Irish ferries get another boat?  Dey are even getting rid of the fast cat when the big new boat arrives any way.  Holyhead to Dover ?

I think perhaps fiachrab has miscounted as they don't have 3 vessels plus a fast craft at Holyhead.  At present they have ULYSSES, EPSILON, and the fast craft JONATHAN SWIFT (soon to be replaced by the former Westpac Express DUBLIN SWIFT).