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Irish Ferries Enthusiasts => The News Board => Topic started by: ccs on September 23, 2020, 06:22:54 pm

Title: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: ccs on September 23, 2020, 06:22:54 pm
Quote
Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January ? IRHA
Eugene Drennan, President of the Irish Road Haulage Association (IRHA) has stated that the current efficiency of a Landbridge route to the European Continent cannot now be regarded as a reliable option for Irish hauliers post-Brexit. 
In an extensive interview with Pat Kenny on Newstalk radio this week, IRHA President Eugene Drennan said the Government must now provide assistance to put regular direct ferries connecting Ireland with mainland Europe. He informed listeners about the practical problems that will face importers and exporters when Britain leaves the European Union (EU) at the end of December. Brexit will effect importers and exporters on two levels. In the first instance tariffs may be imposed by both the EU and the UK, this may in some cases determine if a company can survive in the new environment. In the second instance the logistics of importing and exporting come into the spotlight.
This is where the IRHA is concerned for their members as hold ups and delays will effect truck movements between Ireland and the UK, creating cost, that someone must bear. Trucks going and coming from mainland Europe will likely become caught up in these delays at ferry ports, in spite of assurances to the contrary. Direct ferries will be necessary if the country, importers and exporters is to be spared significant delays to supply chains.

https://fleet.ie/direct-ferries-to-the-continent-must-be-sailing-by-january-irha/ (https://fleet.ie/direct-ferries-to-the-continent-must-be-sailing-by-january-irha/)
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: A83 on September 24, 2020, 08:56:27 am
What are the options? Should the  Government set up a ferry company? Subsidise IF,  Stena or P and O to run a service?

Regarding shipping I suppose Brittany Ferries has some ships lying idle currently, would any of those be suitable for overnight  freight or Ro/Pax service?

One other question, which ports? Dublin seems pretty packed so Rosslare or Cork must be in the frame.....to Cherbourg, Dunkerque?

Interesting times.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: ccs on September 24, 2020, 09:30:05 am
What are the options? Should the  Government set up a ferry company? Subsidise IF,  Stena or P and O to run a service?

Regarding shipping I suppose Brittany Ferries has some ships lying idle currently, would any of those be suitable for overnight  freight or Ro/Pax service?

One other question, which ports? Dublin seems pretty packed so Rosslare or Cork must be in the frame.....to Cherbourg, Dunkerque?

Interesting times.

Saw Le Harve mentioned somewhere as the preferred choice of some hauliers.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: ferryfan on September 24, 2020, 11:25:02 am
Le Havre is the preferred option for hauliers owing mainly to it's better road connections and therefore shorter journey times for the truckers. There is plenty of spare tonnage laid up at the moment so costs should be lower than normal. If our government were to surprise us all by being proactive I think I would have to contact them advising them not to go with Seabourne Freight (ha) as their genius UK counterparts did.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on September 25, 2020, 04:46:58 pm
There has been an increase in media coverage regarding this topic in recent times as the BREXIT transition period is due to come to an end on 31st December next.

Ireland faces devastating blow due to our failure to develop ferry services to Europe - Stephen Collins:
Amid Brexit, Irish trucks need extra ferries to transit goods to and from continent
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/ireland-faces-devastating-blow-due-to-our-failure-to-develop-ferry-services-to-europe-1.4363802

New ferry links in Rosslare and Cork could address Brexit weaknesses - Brendan Howlin
New direct ferry links to the EU are essential according to the Labour TD
https://www.irishexaminer.com/business/economy/arid-40054493.html

Alternative route from Ireland to Europe must be found - hauliers
https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/0923/1166880-no-deal-brexit-v-coronavirus/
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: IFPete on September 25, 2020, 08:18:11 pm
We have the routes in place to Cherbourg , Bilbao, Rotterdam and Zeabrugge and capacity will be be increased as required to support any demand.

epsilon is rarely full when she sails to Cherbourg.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on September 25, 2020, 11:38:03 pm

Routes announced to operate between Republic of Ireland and European Continent during 2021

Dublin    to Rotterdam  - CLdN
Dublin    to Cherbourg  - Irish Ferries
Rosslare to Cherbourg  - Stena Line
Rosslare to Cherbourg  - Brittany Ferries
Rosslare to Bilbao        - Brittany Ferries
Cork       to Roscoff *   - Brittany Ferries
Cork       to Zeebrugge - CLdN

* denotes this route mainly serves tourist market. Cork to Roscoff route will continue to be served by MV Pont Aven with Saturday departures ex-Cork while Brittany Ferries is also set to introduce a mid-week sailing ex-Cork using MV Amorique in 2021

Irish Continental Group (ICG) used operated Rosslare Cherbourg, Rosslare Le Havre along with summer seasonal services Cork Cherbourg and Cork Le Havre until around 1997 however I understand; Irish Ferries now only operates one direct route to the continent nowadays (i.e.) Dublin to Cherbourg services.

I understand from other contributors to this forum that some hauliers would welcome a direct link between Ireland and Le Havre once more. Is there much prospect of any direct Ireland to Le Havre link being re-established in the event of No Deal Brexit becoming a reality after December 31st going forward?   
 
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Kieran on September 26, 2020, 12:45:09 pm
I understand from other contributors to this forum that some hauliers would welcome a direct link between Ireland and Le Havre once more. Is there much prospect of any direct Ireland to Le Havre link being re-established in the event of No Deal Brexit becoming a reality after December 31st going forward?

One of the basic reules of busness is to adapt to supply and demand issues, that's how you gain an edge over your competitiors. BF changed services already at the request of hauliers, if the demand is there, I can't see whay they, Stena or IF wouldn't step in.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on September 28, 2020, 02:01:46 am
Well my understanding is that Brittany Ferries had made public announcements regarding it's ambitious plans for 2021 season however; I've since read subsequent press release statements that warned that BF services would be cut if business volumes did not pick up. If the Coronavirus pandemic situation continues to cause travel chaos well into Spring/Summer 2021 I would not be surprised if this could derail a number of it's proposed service changes announced in recent months as capacity will not be increased especially in routes that largely depend on tourist market like Cork to Roscoff and other similar routes between UK and France/Spain. BF's other Irish routes may also be impacted by whatever is decided after the end of the BREXIT transition period at the end of this year.

Uncertainty in terms of the freight trade & tourist trade business makes it an extremely challenging time for all operators involved in the transport industry for the foreseeable future. Add to that future changes brought about by various governments implementing key climate change measures which puts additional pressure on costs after a terrible 2020 season for all.   

Sources:

https://brittanyferriesnewsroom.com/further-schedule-changes-are-regrettable-but-necessary-says-brittany-ferries/

https://brittanyferriesnewsroom.com/brittany-ferries-confirms-post-august-schedule-changes-as-demand-slumps/   
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: giftgrub on September 28, 2020, 10:13:54 pm
I understand from other contributors to this forum that some hauliers would welcome a direct link between Ireland and Le Havre once more. Is there much prospect of any direct Ireland to Le Havre link being re-established in the event of No Deal Brexit becoming a reality after December 31st going forward?

One of the basic reules of busness is to adapt to supply and demand issues, that's how you gain an edge over your competitiors. BF changed services already at the request of hauliers, if the demand is there, I can't see whay they, Stena or IF wouldn't step in.

Exactly if the demand exists ferries will be found to run the routes or existing routes will be changed to accommodate demand. If Le Harve is suddenly the go to port, then it would not be hard for any of the existing operators to transfer services/ introduce new services.

For example

IF can bring WBY onto Winter services if more capacity required
Stena can pull vessels from other routes or charter additional tonnage from Stena RoRo
BF have a huge fleet including Connemara and Etretat laid up and can be called upon
Cldn can increase services with revised fleet deployment
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on September 29, 2020, 04:38:14 pm
I think the purpose of the OP's thread is that a sense of urgency should be brought to bear on all concerned stakeholders as the impression I get is that the IRHA is clearly worried about a lack of preparation on the ground in the event of a possible "no deal" scenario once the BREXIT transition period ends on 31st December which is about three months away.

Supply and demand is a given however; business needs to continue unhindered or at least with all of the mitigation measures in place as from January 1st if necessary as Ireland inc. will only suffer yet further economic disaster otherwise and we could do without it after the whole COVID-19 crisis. I just hope the Irish government and the EU have a satisfactory Plan B at the ready.

(For the record, I am not associated with the IRHA or any ferry operator).
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Kieran on September 29, 2020, 05:23:02 pm
I just hope the Irish government and the EU have a satisfactory Plan B at the ready.

The UK is (supposed) to join the Common Transit Convention (https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/business/customs-procedures/what-is-customs-transit/common-union-transit_en) on departure from the EU, how that will work in practice remains to be seen.

Ontop of that, acording to the Department of Transport (https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2019-02-12a.1700), there is suficient capacity with IF, Stena, BF and CLdN in the event of the loss of the land bridge corssings via the UK.
Since that assessment, The W.B Yeats has arrived in Dublin (costing ICG ?144 million euro), Stena Vinga has replaced Stena Nordica boosting capacity in Rosslare, and CLdN have invested heavily in ships operating between Cork and Dublin and the contenant.

The actual question we need to ask is have the IRHA done any research, or are they just kicking up a fuss as they don't want to pay for longer crossings?
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on September 29, 2020, 11:23:00 pm
The actual question we need to ask is have the IRHA done any research, or are they just kicking up a fuss as they don't want to pay for longer crossings?
[/quote]

Last time I heard an IRHA spokesperson interviewed on radio, they seemed to be expressing concern about delays, particularly with certain perishable goods like fresh food produce, getting to the stores on time. If they miss certain windows the produce has less time on shelves and ends up becoming past it's sell by dates and is no longer commercially useful. Longer journey and delays at ports in a disorderly scenario could lead to drivers being at risk if they are having to drive beyond their permitted number of hours per day. One could hardly blame this body for articulating their concerns to the media ahead of this important deadline looming.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Kieran on October 06, 2020, 11:04:29 am
Rosslare Port is in talks with an operator to launch a daily direct service according to the Irish Times (https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/rosslare-port-in-talks-for-new-daily-direct-ferry-service-to-continental-europe-1.4372750).
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: ferryfan on October 06, 2020, 12:33:09 pm
In the article it says that the "Southeast port..., is in discussions with a NEW shipping line to start ...."
I wonder who the NEW shipping line might be?
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Chef on October 06, 2020, 02:20:35 pm
I read recently that the hauliers want a sea route to the continent that can match the 20 hour land bridge route , Rosslare to Cherbourg is 17 hours and if La Havre is their preference it's two and a half from Cherbourg so they still beat the 20 hour land bridge time .
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on October 06, 2020, 04:11:34 pm
Perhaps a "NEW" shipping line may not necessarily mean a brand new operator - it may refer to a shipping line that would be new to operating in/out of Rosslare Europort?

Maybe Rosslare Europort's exploratory discussions for launching another direct service to continental Europe is not solely examining France and may also look at other options like routes to The Netherlands or perhaps an additional route option to serve Spain?

Brittany Ferries had switched from their Cork to Santander route by replacing it with a Rosslare to Bilbao link earlier in 2020 although; it's difficult to gauge how successful the change of both departure & destination port has turned out given all of the ongoing disruption this year due to the Coronavirus COVID-19 pandemic. Brittany Ferries also announced their intentions to launch a new Rosslare to Cherbourg route next year. Stena Line already operates a Rosslare to Cherbourg service and Irish Ferries operates a Dublin to Cherbourg service.

There was also a delegation from the Port of Cork that visited Spain to examine the case for a possible Cork to Vigo service but there has been no further updates on that front since the COVID-19 pandemic took hold.
   
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Paul747 on October 08, 2020, 10:27:33 am
A senior Stena crew member hinted to me that there is the ?potential? for Stena to move one of the Dublin Holyhead ships to Rosslare for a direct continental service IF in the event of a no deal brexit departure, demand reduces on the central corridor? Supposing Stena receive 25% of the annual 170000 annual land bridge units transiting through Holyhead, it would mean circa 800 units a week looking to avoid the grid locked UK landbridge. That could potentially support a 2000m+ lane metre ship on a three times a week service? Lot of what if?s and the biggest is obtaining support from the hauliers as it is a more time consuming crossing than is currently available. Un accompanied units are the more likely customers for this potential market, so a large RO Pax ship would not be cost efficient for any potential new route. Also which ever continental port is assessed it would need at least a 100+ trailer park to accommodate this potential traffic.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: IFPete on October 08, 2020, 03:41:49 pm
It all hinges on Demand. Cherbourg is linked by rail to Bayonne and has good road access to French Motorway network.

Rosscoff is too far west for access to central europe.

Irish Ferries are operating Container services to Rotterdam and Antwerp.

If there was demand Irish Ferries would operate daily to Cherbourg,

Even with Brexit , Landbridge is quicker for most freight.

Portsmouth and poole are alternatives to Dover for traffic heading to France, Italy, Switzerland, Spain, Portugal,
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on October 09, 2020, 05:02:22 pm
One would presume that the Irish Road Hauliers Association are quite familiar with Cherbourg and it's onward access benefits although; I thought I read somewhere pre last General Election that a delegation from Irish hauliers went over to visit Le Havre with a view to establishing a Rosslare to Le Havre connection once again. Not sure if the IRHA favours an alternative port to Cherbourg or were merely on a fact finding mission but I gather it was with a view to a no deal Brexit after the transition period ends.

I understand that Le Havre is closer to Paris by road than Cherbourg however; maybe this is no longer as essential for Irish road hauliers using ferry transport?   

Perhaps someone directly involved with the IRHA can provide a fresh update as to what their current additional route preference is?
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on October 09, 2020, 10:43:38 pm

Government may subsidise direct ferry routes to EU post-Brexit, says Coveney

Minister has urged companies to begin testing direct sea routes from next month

The Government is prepared to subsidise direct ferry routes to mainland Europe to ease the movement of goods in a post-Brexit trading environment, Minister for Foreign Affairs Simon Coveney has said.

Goods between Ireland and Europe generally move over the UK ?land bridge? but its departure from the EU has made the route?s future problematic in terms of customs checks and queues at ports.

Mr Coveney has urged companies to begin testing direct sea routes from next month, anticipating some disruption along the land bridge from January.

Full article was published on IrishTimes.com (See below link)

Source:
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/government-may-subsidise-direct-ferry-routes-to-eu-post-brexit-says-coveney-1.4376891
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Trucker on October 18, 2020, 08:48:37 pm
I had a conversation last week with a guy thats involved in the food export market ,and info he has been given is that DFDS are looking at the possibility of starting a daily Ro Ro from Rosslare to Dunkirk.
To complete within 20 hours though would require a steady 25 knots per hour.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Trucker on October 18, 2020, 09:03:30 pm
Also ,having used CLDN Dublin Rotterdam and return frequently ,its ideal if you are short on hours ,and a 45 can be got on it to keep the tacho right , sailing time 42 to 46 hours depending on weather.
Leave Rotterdam Friday evening ,arrive Dublin before lunch Sunday ,better than being parked up for the weekend in Belgium or UK.
3 meals a day ,few beers with lunch and dinner if you like ,and an ensuite cabin to yourself all included ,plus every ship I was on was spotless inside.
Not taking passengers at the moment though due to Covid.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on October 18, 2020, 11:32:49 pm

Irish truckers, ports warn time is running out over Brexit plans

https://www.irishexaminer.com/cms_media/module_img/3986/1993362_19_articlelarge_dan_20ship_203.jpg
A container ship at Tivoli Docks in Cork. Picture: Dan Linehan

SAT, 17 OCT, 2020 - 13:23
JOHN WHELAN
Irish and British businesses, ports, air, and shipping lines, as well as hauliers, looked on in disbelief as the EU and UK political leaders once again pushed out their 'we-want-a-deal-but-are-ready-for-no-deal' statements, following the failure to meet last week's deadline for an exit agreement.

The threats sound increasingly less credible as the  coronavirus economic devastation becomes clearer by the week. In a rational world, neither the UK nor the EU could afford to add another crisis to the unprecedented recession.

The extent of the impact of Covid-19 on business preparations for Brexit was seen in a recent UK survey: It showed that two-thirds of businesses had their Brexit preparations disrupted, and only  25% were highly confident about dealing with the extra administrative burden.

The main barriers for Irish companies preparing for Brexit, said Enterprise Ireland, were the uncertainty around Britain's exit from the EU and Covid-19.

The Enterprise Ireland survey of 600 companies revealed that customs and logistics are the priorities among businesses as the January Brexit deadline approaches.

Most businesses are relying on their sub-supplier network of freight forwarders, hauliers, shipping lines, and airlines, as well as the port operators, to get their goods in and out of the UK market.

They are focused on upgrading their IT systems and training staff to handle the export-import documentation, safety and security filings, Vat, and tariff-duty payments.

The budget could have gone further in supporting companies in the freight-distribution and logistics sectors to prepare for the economic and operational shocks, said Aidan Flynn, general manager, Freight Transport Association Ireland.

"If a trade agreement between the EU and UK is not forthcoming, it will deliver a deep, sharp shock to the movement of goods between Britain and Ireland," Mr Flynn said. 

"This scenario would create significant logjams in customs systems and delays at borders, as the infrastructure, enforcement regime, and the private sector will not be fully prepared," he said, warning that the budget had failed to fund training and to encourage more direct routes between Ireland and continental Europe.

The British Road Haulage Association is of the same mind, saying that the "time is desperately short" to clarify arrangements for lorries and goods crossing the Irish Sea at the end of the Brexit transition period.

It said the UK government's proposals for goods movements between Wales and Ireland were still "slim on detail". If lorries are not prepared, they would be prevented from crossing.

The UK's Revenue and Customs indicate that around 600 lorries and trailers a day leave Holyhead Port, the UK's second-biggest roll-on-and-roll-off facility.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/cms_media/module_img/3986/1993488_13_articleinline_jw_20photo_20--head.jpg
John Whelan is the managing partner of The Linkage-Partnership.

There are no arrangements for a lorry park on Anglesey to hold any lorries unable to board a ferry for Ireland, potentially hitting Irish importers.

However, lorries arriving from Ireland will not face any checks by UK authorities, who have given until July 2021 for completion of import documentation.

The UK has signed up to the Common Travel Convention, which means exporters routing goods through the UK, and onwards to the continent, won?t face any change to the current customs documentation.

However, there are reports that the main EU-facing ports of Dover and Felixstowe may see extensive delays.

Irish ports will be required to deal with the impact of Brexit to varying degrees.

Dublin and Rosslare, which handle over 90% of the truck roll-on roll-off movements of goods to the UK, have invested heavily in facilities to handle the expected increase in customs inspections and documentation processing.

The Port of Cork, which is primarily a container lift-on lift-off port, is somewhat isolated from the tumult of Brexit, and there are signs that exporters worried about congestion in using the UK as a land bridge are moving to direct container shipping to the Continent.

Boris Johnson's internal markets bill has complicated trading with the North.

Businesses had geared up to the Northern Ireland Protocol, whose main tenet was that only goods meeting EU standards would be sold in the North, even if the goods were from Britain.

Traders and their hauliers will, once again, be expected to come up with instantaneous solutions to last-minute political decisions.

John Whelan is managing partner of international trade consultancy, the Linkage-Partnership

Irish Examiner

Source:
https://www.irishexaminer.com/business/economy/arid-40066968.html
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on October 19, 2020, 03:31:24 pm
'Brexit buster' can 'dramatically' increase direct ferries to Europe
Shipping line CLdN says it has ?contingencies? for UK ?landbridge? delays in a hard Brexit

by Simon Carswell Public Affairs Editor

https://www.irishtimes.com/polopoly_fs/1.4384467.1603046849!/image/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/box_620_330/image.jpg
CLdN operates the MV Celine ship out of Dublin where it was launched in 2018. Photograph: Cyril Byrne


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/brexit-buster-can-dramatically-increase-direct-ferries-to-europe-1.4384469?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fpolitics%2Fbrexit-buster-can-dramatically-increase-direct-ferries-to-europe-1.4384469


Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Steven on October 19, 2020, 03:44:19 pm
A few points on this discussion

Le Havre from a ferry operator point of view is further away than Cherbourg for not a lot of benefit but increased cost and reduced utilisation.  From a haulier point of view they are potentially paying a driver to sit on a ship longer when they could be overtaking the ship on the road.

Running a ship at a "steady 25 knots" is pretty much out of the question.  Most ships likely to be employed on such a service aren't even capable of 25 knots!  Rosslare - Dunkirk might make more sense for a CLdN style unaccompanied service.  Speaking of which, I'm not sure CLdN/Cobelfret have any intention of taking drivers again, particularly on the longer sectors such as Ireland to Europe.  They've briefed press about how their costs are lower as they don't carry drivers for example.

The supply of suitable vessels for freight orientated services isn't that good at present, its passenger vessels like Stena Saga and Pride of York which are "spare".  Running the more passenger orientated vessels, even with subsidy, is unlikely to be very profitable IMO.

Its not often mentioned, but at present Ireland - France is oversupplied already (hence Brittany Ferries freight orientated service to France being seasonal, and Stena being able to put less than ideal (and in the case of Vinga, smaller) vessels on their Cherbourg route if Horizon is required elsewhere.  The most logical option to increase capacity would be Stena doubling frequency to Cherbourg, something that wouldn't be that hard to do considering they have ships which appear to be spare.  One of Flavia or Scottish Viking should be spare in January, and Stena Vinga is obviously already surplus to requirements anyway.  Hence her little excursion to our waters.  Its also a fact that a significant amount of landbridge traffic originates or is destined for Northern Ireland - for that it may be more attractive to use landbridge from Belfast, Larne, Warrenpoint and the North Sea.


A senior Stena crew member hinted to me that there is the ?potential? for Stena to move one of the Dublin Holyhead ships to Rosslare for a direct continental service IF in the event of a no deal brexit departure, demand reduces on the central corridor? Supposing Stena receive 25% of the annual 170000 annual land bridge units transiting through Holyhead, it would mean circa 800 units a week looking to avoid the grid locked UK landbridge. That could potentially support a 2000m+ lane metre ship on a three times a week service? Lot of what if?s and the biggest is obtaining support from the hauliers as it is a more time consuming crossing than is currently available. Un accompanied units are the more likely customers for this potential market, so a large RO Pax ship would not be cost efficient for any potential new route. Also which ever continental port is assessed it would need at least a 100+ trailer park to accommodate this potential traffic.
There are 150,000 annual movements and that is for both directions (official figures).  Thats of around 450,000 total RoRo movements though Holyhead (the landbridge figure naturally doesn't account for trailers which stop and discharge or load partially in GB en-route of course).  Thats not as much as it sounds if we account for the fact that there is existing excess capacity on Ireland-France (some say its running at around 50%), and that not everything will be suitable to transit on the direct routes.  Rates are going to be a big factor as well - they'll inevitably be much higher on the direct routes than short sea. Of course, Calais and Portsmouth aren't the only ports used for landbridge via Holyhead either.  Dropping a ship on Dublin - Holyhead would massively reduce their capacity there, by at least 6,200 lane metres in each direction per day. 
Another point of note, for a lot of traffic which uses landbridge France isn't the ultimate destination.  Perhaps there will be increased demand for landbridge to the "Low Countries" rather than France, particularly if a scheme is agreed where trailers can pass through the UK more or less unobstructed if sealed and the appropriate paperwork is already forwarded as has been suggested.

Personally IF the worst case scenario happens I can see a combination of an increased use of North Sea (already happening), switch to unaccompanied direct services to Europe, and LoLo services.  CLdN are banking on the middle option and ICG will certainly like the last one!
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Steven on October 19, 2020, 03:54:58 pm
More on the potential for capacity being added by an existing operator here

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/brexit-buster-can-dramatically-increase-direct-ferries-to-europe-1.4384469

And a key quote

Quote
"The company, which began sailing to Dublin in 2009, accounts for 40 per cent of all units moved between Dublin and continental Europe, averaging about 4,500 freight units a week or 116,000 a year each way."
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: jgf on November 05, 2020, 09:14:02 pm
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/daily-ferries-to-france-starting-from-january-to-bypass-brexit-congestion-1.4401537 (https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/daily-ferries-to-france-starting-from-january-to-bypass-brexit-congestion-1.4401537)
Irish Ferries and Stena plan to run alternate week schedules on their ferries to Cherbourg so that there is a direct, roll-on, roll-off ferry service for lorries every day from next year.

Irish Ferries will operate a Monday, Wednesday, Friday and Sunday service one week from Dublin to the port, in addition to their usual Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday weekly departures.

Stena will continue its service between Rosslare and Cherbourg on Tuesdays, Thursdays and Saturdays and plans to add a Monday, Wednesday, Friday and Sunday service on the week Irish Ferries does not sail on these days from Dublin to ensure a daily service between Ireland and mainland Europe.

Irish Ferries declined to comment on the new service.



It appears confusing, are they adding Ferries or just tweaking their schedules?
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: A83 on November 06, 2020, 08:28:10 am
It seems that the current ships [Stena Horizon and Epsilon or WB Yeats] are to make sailings on alternate days.

As always the NI ferry site is helpful here.

https://www.niferry.co.uk/irish-ferries-and-stena-line-to-offer-daily-ireland-france-ferry-service/
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on November 06, 2020, 11:46:38 pm
I was listening to Drivetime on RTE Radio 1 on Friday evening (6th November) and Verona Murphy was speaking about the challenges faced by road hauliers getting their produce from Ireland over to the Continent after 1st January and the point was made about Stena Line and Irish Ferries having reportedly agreed to cooperate to offer a daily service for the haulage industry between Ireland and France next year although it was claimed that the ferry companies have not confirmed anything to them. She seemed frustrated that government was not doing nearly enough to ensure that things would be in place from start of January and felt that haulage companies should be consulted properly before they go about formulating policy in this regard.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: A83 on November 11, 2020, 09:40:25 am
RTE analysis of the direct to France Ro/Ro, Ro/Pax situation last evening.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/1110/1177265-hauliers-brexit-landbridge/

again they mention talks between Rosslare port and a ferry company, all very mysterious.

 One thing seems clear hauliers want a [daily] Rosslare departure point as it makes for the shortest trip to France.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: ferryfan on November 12, 2020, 12:40:31 pm
Irish government have launched a communication campaign advising business to get ready and to consider using direct routes to the continent.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Trucker on November 27, 2020, 08:33:06 am
I had a conversation last week with a guy thats involved in the food export market ,and info he has been given is that DFDS are looking at the possibility of starting a daily Ro Ro from Rosslare to Dunkirk.
To complete within 20 hours though would require a steady 25 knots per hour.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/new-direct-ferry-to-dunkirk-will-be-valuable-entry-point-for-lorries-to-europe-after-brexit-1.4420716
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: ferryfan on November 27, 2020, 11:35:19 am
This is a huge commitment by DFDS 3 vessels dedicated to a new route some speculation that MV Kerry could be one of the vessels. Have the existing operators being caught napping or were they just not willing to take the gamble? time will tell. A 24 hour crossing as opposed to a 15 or 16 hour crossing through Holyhead/Rosslare to Dover might make sense.
If you allow for the mandatory driver breaks ie 45 minutes break after every 4 1/2 hours,the drive from Holyhead to Dover takes approx 9 hours depending on traffic the two ferry crossing times 3/12 and 2 hours and waiting times say an hour at each port  come to a travel time of approximately 18 hours then add in the unknown the new customs procedures which I suspect will ad at least a couple more hours.
Further details are expected later today from DFDS.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Paul Arbuckle on November 27, 2020, 03:19:58 pm
Timetable here:

https://www.dfds.com/en/freight-shipping/routes-and-schedules/rosslare-dunkirk
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Chef on November 27, 2020, 04:14:48 pm
This is a huge commitment by DFDS 3 vessels dedicated to a new route some speculation that MV Kerry could be one of the vessels. Have the existing operators being caught napping or were they just not willing to take the gamble? time will tell. A 24 hour crossing as opposed to a 15 or 16 hour crossing through Holyhead/Rosslare to Dover might make sense.
If you allow for the mandatory driver breaks ie 45 minutes break after every 4 1/2 hours,the drive from Holyhead to Dover takes approx 9 hours depending on traffic the two ferry crossing times 3/12 and 2 hours and waiting times say an hour at each port  come to a travel time of approximately 18 hours then add in the unknown the new customs procedures which I suspect will ad at least a couple more hours.
Further details are expected later today from DFDS.
Plus the 3 to 3 and a half hours to cross to the UK from Dublin or Rosslare .
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on November 27, 2020, 04:27:51 pm

Meanwhile, another ferry provider CLdN has announced it will run a second service from Cork to Zeebrugge in Belgium to cope with extra demand.

The addition of a second call customers customers will have a quicker turnaround, as well as bypassing the UK land bridge and avoiding unnecessary border checks, ensuring cargo flows more effectively and in a cost-efficient manor from Ireland direct to the continent.

Conor Mowlds, Port of Cork Chief Commercial Officer said: "In these extraordinary times a second direct Ro-Con freight link with Europe from Cork, Ireland?s primary southern gateway reinforces our commitment to supporting businesses in the region and preparing for any eventuality Brexit may bring."

Source: Irish Examiner
https://www.irishexaminer.com/business/arid-40091360.html
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: CH1 on November 27, 2020, 07:25:12 pm
Do you think that the Cherbourg service could be shadowed very soon by this new route ? I don't know how Stena and Irish Ferries will handle this ...
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: IFPete on November 27, 2020, 08:58:33 pm
We are comparing apples and cabbages here.

Both Stena and Irish Ferries dont see the investment being worth it. In fact Irish Ferries will run run a freight only service  on Dublin - Cherbourg from 1 Jan 2021 to 25 May 2021 according to current timetables.

The big question will be will there be enough denand for the new DFD service to last beyond easter.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on November 27, 2020, 11:46:55 pm

I recall that Brittany Ferries had also announced in recent months of it's intentions to begin a new Rosslare to Cherbourg service as from 22nd March, 2021 until late October as a seasonal service.

I wonder if today's announcement by DFDS to commence it's new Rosslare to Dunkirk route X 6 days a week starting on 2nd January will impact on Brittany Ferries plans in this regard?
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Trucker on November 28, 2020, 10:23:28 pm
Had a further conversation today with the guy that initially speculated about this back in October, for which he has been proved right.
Further speculation now that containers will be shipped on this route rather than from Dublin or Waterford to Rotterdam.
One of the main carriers his company use is DFDS shipping fron Waterford twice weekly ,and this new route will inprove the company KPI's , offering quicker delivery times from production to customer.
Win win for DFDS really ,and would make this route very compettitive ,and viable.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: Kieran on November 29, 2020, 06:28:59 pm

I recall that Brittany Ferries had also announced in recent months of it's intentions to begin a new Rosslare to Cherbourg service as from 22nd March, 2021 until late October as a seasonal service.

I wonder if today's announcement by DFDS to commence it's new Rosslare to Dunkirk route X 6 days a week starting on 2nd January will impact on Brittany Ferries plans in this regard?

I was under the impression they are appealing to different markets. DFDS aren't planning on promoting the new route to passengers for the moment, whereas Brittany Ferries will promote Cherbourg. I think Covid restrictions will do more damage than competition.
Title: Re: Direct Ferries to the Continent must be sailing by January - IRHA
Post by: awaityourreply on December 01, 2020, 05:18:24 pm
True, I read that DFDS are initially focusing it's new Rosslare to Dunkirk route on freight although; they may expand it further by promoting it as a tourist option at a later stage if demand is there. While I appreciate that Brittany Ferries new Rosslare to Cherbourg seasonal service will permit passengers much like it's existing Rosslare to Bilbao service (and previously Cork to Santander) I think it's unlikely to be hugely popular with passengers given the vessel used (i.e.) "Connemara". All of these services are primarily aimed at the freight business sector unlike say Brittany Ferries Cork to Roscoff service on it's flagship vessel, "Pont Aven" on Saturdays ex-Cork - in fact, I almost forgot with all the announcements in recent months that Brittany Ferries is also providing a additional Cork to Roscoff sailing option using cruise ferry "Armorique" on Wednesday afternoons next season.